Talk:GN Drive Tau
Added some info about the Drives and the Particles. Tau Particles are only harmful in highly concentrated forms,emissions are safe- 00 World Report S2 Tau Drives are harmless- Directors Interview;forgot which one but it was post-S2 and they were discussing each of the S2 episodes in it.I've got a link to the translation if needed. Tau Particle Explanation;they're the same as the Originals but get different treatment from the Drive and use diffrent compression rates,just that they were optimised for beam weaponsry because they cant afford to use as much;the treatment gave the particles much better beam efficiency but also gave it a radiation poisoning effect at high concentrations like beams.-Heard it was mentioned in the 300 Years Later book that came out a long time ago and also in the Official File 6. -SonicSP GN Tau Drive MKII I'm just suggesting a nomenclature to delineate the red emitting drives from the later, orange emitting drives. I also think that once we get a consensus on this, the Alvatore article should be tweaked because it has orange/yellow particles Nkuzmik 20:48, September 24, 2009 (UTC) The way I see it,there have been 3 different types so far.The main reds from S1,Alvatore and the orange ones from S2. Red=Poisonous Victims=Louise, Golden=Poisonous Victims-Lasse Orange=Stated to be harmless,Unknown if any radiation poison vitims exist,the only GN-Drives that are knowned not to have caused any radiation poisoning. For the record,the green GNP are said to be harmless as well but Chall has suffered from radiation poisoning from it.Her symptoms are the same as Louise,which is damage to the telomeres,which affects her cell division.Regenerative treatment cannot be done.Treatment requires the telomeres to be repaired using advanced nanomachines are normally present to Innovedos.Once treatment is complete,perpetual youth is achieved,probably because the cells can't degenerate anymore since the telomeres has been artificially affected somehow.Probably the same way Innovedos cant age because of their nanomachines. All emission GNP from Tau Drives are harmless by the way,only in beam form are they harmful.Stated in 00 World Report.The green particles are not suppose to cause radiation poisoning of any sort,but it sort of did. Personally though,I think its possible that the chances of getting the radiation poisoning differs with each GNP wavelenght,the green being the least poisonous with red being the most.The severity may differ as well,Chall completely recovered from her effects in some way,except maybe the change hair color while Louise seemed to be still suffering some sort of effect,Lasse seemed to stll be suffering from some as well,so the severity may be the ultimate difference. I suggest we keep it the same,the reason is because we know too little about the specifics of the other Drives,and they're all mostly the same anyways.They're still GN-Drive Taus.SonicSP 15:31, November 20, 2009 (UTC) :If I we a betting fellow, I would say that Chall's case is one of dosage. When ever you are talking about exposing a biological system to anything else, its all about the dosage, and the duration. :If a tanker truck full of plain old milk gets dumped into a river, it will mess with the pH and can kill everything in that river. Believe it or not, there is such a thing as Oxygen poisoning. --Nkuzmik 15:41, November 20, 2009 (UTC) :SonicSp is right, it's only the beams that cause the cellular defects, not the drives. The green GN particles can be harmful. The reason why Chall was scarred and not Setsuna is again, because of the dosage. Chall got a very large blast of GN Particles in a short amount of time, more than a human can endure (reason why Ruido and Marlene were killed). However, Setsuna was exposed to GN particles, with a steady dosage over his seven years as a Gundam Meister, allowing him to slowly evolve into an Innovator.Gaeaman788 16:23, November 20, 2009 (UTC) ::Oh, that's good I never even considered the fact that Setsuna has clocked more hours driving a Gundam than anyone else...--Nkuzmik 16:29, November 20, 2009 (UTC) :::^Thats a good argument for his Innovation actually,especially in regard to his piloting of 00.Though in regard to the poisonous cellular radiation,its probably a large amount of beam particles in a short period that probably matters. Also,my opinion on Chall has changed a bit from what I said earlier.While I think that her telomeres is damaged from the beam particle exposure,I don't think she gotten the GN Cancer like Louise and Lasse did.Of course their telomeres was damaged too but I think in Chall's case her telomeres is damaged but I don't think she got the cancer immediately,although a damaged telomeres would probably make you prone to cancer sooner or later,GN or not. So in the end it could be a bad case,but the negativity of the radiation may not be as bad or extreme as if the exact same incident was repeated with a Tau Drive MS.Although she probably could not have any regeneration treatment until she got it repaired,which she did with the nanomachine treatment.Oh and she got eternal youth as well from that,just like the Innovedos.-SonicSP 11:02, February 2, 2010 (UTC) Drive Destruction? Do the GN Drive Tau really destroyed after an equipped mobile suit uses the Tran Am system developed by Billy Katagiri? I don't think that's true, at least not for all of them. In episode 25 of S2 Revive and Hiling are seen piloting their Gadessa and Garazzo when in episode 24 they used Trans Am. Also in episode 25 Reborns Gundam uses Trans Am, after which its remaining GN Drive is intact and functional. Is there any evidence from the show that points to a GN Drive Tau's destruction after Trans Am?--Animefan29 21:20, September 25, 2009 (UTC) I can't point to any direct evidence. We can't really use the Gaga's. They never lasted long enough. So the only suits we can use from the anime are the Gadessa, Garazzo, Masurao, Susanowo, and Reborns. I'm pretty sure that Aker said he was out or running out of particles when he withdrew after the first time he Trans Am'ed the Masurao. On the other hand, those of us watching Sci-Fi channel got rather hosed because we always missed the stuff during the credits. Nkuzmik 12:58, September 28, 2009 (UTC) :We know that it seems to do heavy damage,close to the point of destruction.I'll see if I can dig up some old translation profiles somewhere later but the 2 sources that have mentioned is is the DX Mechanics March 09 Issue and the HG Hilling Garazzo manual.The former also used the Masuruo battle as an example,both translation attribute the destruction/heavy damage to all Tau Drives. :But the basic idea is that the Drives are destroyed after Trans-Am and the suit relies on its remaining Condenser supply after that HG Hilling Garazzo manual.Graham was probably referring to his Condenser supply,the Original Gundams would always their GN Drive to leave the functional and battle worthy after Trans-Am at least,even if weakened. :In the case of Gadessa and Garazzo in S2 23,Homeless from Mechatalk pointed out that the Gadessa that appeared in the final scene of S2 23,they saw Seravee on the CB surface to be using the basic set of equipment of some sort.It was just a short observation,not sure whether she was right either but it presents an interestin idea that Hilling and Revive switch their mobile suits each time they use Trans-Am dssapear off the screen after Seravee and crashed onto the CB surface during Trans-Am Burst.Their base is right there in ront of them and we know that they are many Garazzo and Gadessas in existence,so a few spare lying in their main Innovator base is not too hard to imagine. :But they are always other possibilities as well.It is possible that the Drives are only completely destroyed after a full usage of the Trans-Am,due to the heavy damage the furnace sustains during the process.So using a shorter period may allow the Drive to only suffer a certain degree of damage,its porbably heavy damage but it may still be functioning a bit. :The same can be said of Reborns as well,if the Drives are indeed functioning still,than it may just be heavily damaged and not destroyed yet and may still function at a minimum level.Ribbons and Setsuna Trans-Am battle did not appear to eb that long either,though Im just using video time estimation here,which may not necessaily correspond to the same amount of time in the series. :The Drive Destruction may also be a forsawn consequences ahead of time so its possbile that they have developed a system that seperates the Drive from the GN Transfusion System that in between cone thruster unit,allowing the suit to diect its particles to the thruster unit while bypassing the damaged Drive.This may not be much to Reborns,who does have a seperate thruster on the back but the main thruster of Garazzo and Gadessa are still from the GN-Drives on the Escape Unit.Just a thought of course.SonicSP 18:06, October 14, 2009 (UTC) Source information Insert formula here I did some looking around for the history of GN Drives. In fact, you could consider the Tau Drives the original GN Drives. Here's an English translated source that I used. --Gaeaman788 04:47, November 4, 2009 (UTC) That was an old rumour informaiton that appeared long time ago,I think the original rumour itself was in Japanese.It was already proven false a long time ago in the community. It also contradicts info from the 300 Years Later book,translated by C.A. from animesuki,who owns the book. But I'm sure someone would question the validity of the above source as well,so I'll present something stronger.If you want stronger evidence,it directly contradicts info from the 6th Official File as well,especially the part concerning Aeolia creating GN-Drives beforehand,he didnt.GN-Drives,alongside other things like Veda,were simply theories in Aeolia's time.He never got the chance to create them himself,infact,he dint even suggested the Jupiter thing.That was discovered by the later generation of scientists that found the creation of a GN-Drive to be impossible without Jupiter's enviroument. Again,from the 300 Years Later book,the TD Blanket isnt a filtering mechanism,its an energy generation mechanism mainly.And the S1 Tau Drives poisonous nature didnt come from the nature drives themselves but because of the way the particles are tuned,more specifically their wavelenghts.The red particles in S1 are tumed for beam potency,they had to do this because their GNP generation capacity is limited.They CAN match the output of the Originals,but the problems here is energy consumption,the energy consumption is quite unreasonable for the Tau drives to handle economically,once the calculation is done,their average generation rate is lower because their energy consumption concerns,while the Original Drives have no such concerns with their limitless energy supply.For the record it was released even before S2,this info I mean. Most of all,it contradicts Trans-Am,who says that it uses red particles.This contradict anime visuals,since the Original Gundams don't use red particles at all in Trans-Am.Hell,even in S2 the orange particles suits turn red.Then there's the ridiculous part about the GN Arms,before the Special Edition I,we've never evne seen the pilots use Trans-Am with GN Arms at all. The Orange Drives in S2 are no longer poisonous,accoding to the 2307-2312 Mission Complete.I dont think we know yet exactly why.IE:what has been done to the particle tuning ETC? Though they are some theories around,basically the closer performance of the nwer Tau drive in comparison to Original Drives means that they can afford less beam optimised wavelengths,reducing the poisoning nature of the particles as well as the beam potency but it means that the average GNP output has increased because their more energy efficient.The part about the nwer Tau drives are closer to the Originals is mentioned in the HG Gadessa manual.But remember this last bit is just theory for now. SonicSP 15:07, November 20, 2009 (UTC) Designer Well,I don't think stating a designer now would be appropriate since we don't have the slightest clue who he is. However,I will state this.Many vital info on the Drives were possessed by the Corner faction due to that purple Haro they found in the colony ship,if I'm not mistaken the S1 Novel Volume 2 states those 2 guys are alejandro's ancestors and are part of the Corner faction.The real designer is argueble since Ribbons probably played a key role in the entire plan of Alejandro,but since the Corner faction held some vital data for awhile I wont be surprised if they were the ones who played a vital role in it and developed the easier to produced Tau Drive over the 80 year period. This part onwards is my personal speculation,but I feel like its Ribbons who needed the Tau Drive data from Alejandro not the other way around.Because he left CB officially as a Meister,he wants to have his own access to GN fighting technology and the R&D data from the developed Tau Drive might have helped.I think Ribbons may have supplied them with R&D data from CB's GNMS development,since we know Tau Drive machines like the Thrones all derived from the 0 Gundam's technology forgot which development chart mentioned that though,but Ribbons himself may have lacked actual GN-Drives so acquiring the Tau Drive data by joining Alejandro may be one way to get that vital thing he needs.Of course,this second paragraph is totally speculation on my part. I still think we should just say unknown though,seems like the best neutral option.-SonicSP 21:17, January 28, 2010 (UTC) Fuel source and thermodynamics Given the recent translations confirming that GN Tau drives are electrically fueled, I'm drafting a passage to explore that a bit more. While I was pondering that, I came to some conclusions. What we've been treating as a single discrete unit, is in fact two very separable systems. The "GN drive" consists of an isotopic fuel source, housed in a mechanism by which radiometric decay is harnessed. I suspect that it is converted directly into electrical energy, in a method similar to betavoltaicshttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Betavoltaics. That electrical energy then directed into a mechanism produces GN particles. Those particles then go on to power the unit's weapons, actuators, and propulsion systems. Where I'm going with this is that the final stages of a GN and a GNT drive are virtually identical, it is just what feeds them that makes them different. Consider the difference between a coal power plant and a nuclear power plant. Both use a fuel source that heats water that powers steam turbines. Based on this new information, I think we need to reexamine some of the given information about GN drives and their components. --Nkuzmik 14:22, February 1, 2010 (UTC) :Dont have any objections to that,I do have my own simple theory on Tau Drives but I agree mostly with what you say. Of course,based on my reading of the Tau componants in the article,they really are just copy pasted from the description on 00's 1/100 manual. Although we have known this for awhile,although the GN-Drive Tau info from the MG GN-X manual translation that we've gotten recently has clarified it for so the knowledge becomes better solidified We actually need a translation of the Drei manual actually,there a small mention on Tau Drives there.We of Animesuki just recently discovered a very useful model kit chinese instructions database,so maybe I'll go check out the Drei transcript there.SonicSP 10:50, February 2, 2010 (UTC) GN Drive Tau Designs >=P I've noticed that Reborns Gundam GN Tau Drives has an original GN Drive design then the usual GN Tau Drive look. Should we make a section that talks about the exterior design? Dav7d2 07:01, November 28, 2010 (UTC) No, don't think it's necessarry. The RebornsGundams' drive cones were made that way for size purposes. The Aheads, GNX's, and the GNZ series have that pointedish cone shape drive cap. Difference in the shape of the drive caps isn't really warrated and ther's probably not much info on the drive cap effectsGaeaman788 07:50, November 28, 2010 (UTC) :I don't see what your referring to David (can I just call you that?I'm lazy to type the 7 and 2 >__>), they look mostly like other Tau Drives. :Other than that, it should be noted that the Original Drives real original shape is a giant cylindrical cone like the one Nadleeh ejected. Pre 3.5 Gens, these were usually connected to some sort of add on device like a cone or so. However in the 3.5 Gens, CB actually adapted the more advanced Drive Chassis designs of the Tau suits. The chassis designs used by the Gn-X and Thrones even in S1 was more advanced than CB's (as are their GN transfusion systems, which was also adopted by CB in the 3.5 Gens. That's why all the large purple wires are absent and the new system just uses the links inside body directly. Even Exia R2 got this upgrade) :If, you think they may be similar, it may be because of 00 Gundam's cones, however it should note that 00 Gundam itself adopted this from the GN-X cones. The manual even made mention of this general advanced adoptation. With smaller chassis sizes, they can use the Drives in more specialised manners as the 3.5/4th Gens does. :It should be noted that the Chassis designed is not related to whether a Drive is Tau or not, it's just a design that any Drive can adapt. It's just a coincidence that the enemy factions in S1 already developed their Chassis more advanced their CB. -SonicSP 13:39, November 28, 2010 (UTC) Possibility to create a GN Drive Tau into reality Is it possible to create a GN Drive Tau (aka Pseudo Solar Reactor) into this world from the television series of Mobile Suit Gundam 00. HarryAck 21:40, February 7, 2011 (UTC) Their maybe a posibility to create a Pesudo Solar Reactor by researching Baryonic Matter and Solar Energy, but I think we can create the componets of both the GN Drive Tau and the Original GN Drives if we put our heads together. HarryAck 03:18, February 9, 2011 (UTC) :Just like the original Drive, unlikely. Not in the way it's presented in the series, the particle properties are too convenient. =SonicSP 22:09, February 7, 2011 (UTC) :Long after we died. However, like what SonicSP had stated, very unlikely. We usually post in chornological order, it's less confusing that way. Anyways, the biggest problem is that there is absolutely no real life theoretical basis for GN Particles in the way that we see it. Essentially, the show just took a bunch of vague theoretical concepts and that combine them together to create "magic" via the power of science fiction. Sure, topological defects and byronic matter may be real but physics even these are general terms. Truth is, you can divide this even further into a thousand different categories and subcategories and the show bases itself on none of them. The show basically took a general quantum physic term and took liberties with it in the name of science fiction. Now for the purposes of fiction and the ever mysterious quantum physics now and the possibilities it has in the future, the show's general terms are good enough. A semi perpetual generator is quite possible in the future but exactly like a GN Drive and it's "super valuable GN Particles" is likely impossible since it's a very fictional convenient particle. Veda by contrast is quite a realistic possibility, being a quantum computer. Whether somebody creates one faster than the others and dominates the rest of the IT world like in the series remains to be seen, but quantum computer as a concept is quite solid. Even Veda's ability to predict the future has real life basis in a secret algoritm that the US govt claims to have but cannot be analysed since they wont reveal it to the rest of us. On an unrelated note, solar energy is not related to GN Drives at all despite them being known as solar furnaces. -SonicSP 05:20, February 9, 2011 (UTC)